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Lello
05-11-06, 16:08
Hi
I've got the chance to buy a brand new Canon 20D complete with standard lens for 600.00. Not knowing very much about this camera can anyone tell me if this a deal not to be missed and how the camera rates. I know it is a discontinued product now but as I was originally thinking to buy the Nikon D80I'm now not sure what to do. Any views/pointers would be gratefully welcome.

Lello

miketoll
05-11-06, 17:28
The 20D is a superb camera but the standard zoom, if thats the one you mean, is not very impressive. I love my 20D but somewhat reluctantly feel that the Nikon D80 is the better buy. I am waiting to see what Canon will come up with as a 30D replacement which will no doubt have sensor cleaning built in among other improvements- just don't tell my wife!

Lello
05-11-06, 17:51
It is the Standard zoom lens, I think for the money (£600) I might as well wait till the January sales and see what sort of price I can get the D80 for. hopefully just a "body only" might be round about £500 (the D80 is now about £550) and with a little extra cash I might be able to buy a half decent zoom lens as well.

robski
05-11-06, 17:58
Like Mike I'm putting my pennies away for the 30D replacement once the price has dropped. Lello it maybe worth waiting untill after the Jan Sales. I've noticed that camera prices drop steadily for about 5-6 months from release.

miketoll
05-11-06, 18:00
Yep, that sounds the best idea. The D80 is the best ''budget'' buy at the moment according to all the revues I've read. I'm only reluctant to say buy Nikon 'cos I'm a Canon man but have to admit it's the best at the moment.

Lello
05-11-06, 20:53
Like Mike I'm putting my pennies away for the 30D replacement once the price has dropped. Lello it maybe worth waiting until after the Jan Sales. I've noticed that camera prices drop steadily for about 5-6 months from release.

The 30D replacement might be more than I want to spend,
I have been out looking and playing with the Canon 400D and the Nikon D80 over the last couple of weeks, And I just don't like the feel of the 400D, It seems to small for my hands (just doesn't feel right for me)
Like I said earlier, I found a 20D today and I liked the feel of that, It felt a bit like the D80, comfortable and solid. That's why I asked if 600 was a good price, But having come home and thinking about it, do I really want to buy a camara that is now about 2 years old! Hence my choice for the D80. I haven't
yet played with the 30D, Maybe if it has the feel of the 20D and the price comes down after the launch of the replacement then I might change my mind again. (I was indecisive but now I'm not sure:) )

sassan
05-11-06, 22:44
20D is a very good camera set the mark in time and yes its not the newest technology in todays market, though and adequate machine for years to come. Apart from larger LCD and spot metering, not much is different between the 20D and 30D. I guess you got a very good advise from miketoll. If you can wait a bit more, you should be able to get the new body replacement for 20D. Your other options are to get 20D that its price is dropped due to existence of 30D and once a newer one is out, you can dispose it at slight loss, and Canon usually keeps its price. The other option is of course 80D considering that you're no more with canon's glass and products.
Well its hard but you're the one that should make the final decision and remember as long as you have your money in your pocket, you have the easy buying power. Make the one decision that keeps you happiest and no mater what, waiting and refrain form impulsive decisions works perfectly in your favor.

Christine
05-11-06, 23:32
Lots of 20D bodies available used.It is a great cam.Why not check out the 400D,body only.When I went to buy the 350D,there were so many negative comments re the build of the camera,and the small grip etc,but it turned out to be one of the top selling cameras ,along with the 20D.I have both these cams.If I were choosing a cam now,I would maybe go for the 400D body only,or a 20D (body only) and spend the surplus cash on a better lens.One can have a top of the range cam,but if you do not have a decent lens,then your money is wasted.

Lello
06-11-06, 00:20
Thanks for all your feedback, Sassan,you're right in what you say about impulsive buying, I was so close to buying the 20D today my hand was getting the plastic out when my wife asked what I knew about the 20d and I came to my senses with a start, came home and started reading reviews and posting this thread and realized that it had been discontinued so I was so glad my wife stopped me doing something I might have regretted. Christine, When I first heard and read about the 400D It was the cam I was going to buy It's only when Don said I needed to play with it and feel it I realized It was not for me (Doesn't feel right) as much as I thought it was going to be my first D SLR cam, Unfortunately the 400D is not for me. At the moment as Sassan said my money is in my pocket I'm happy with my Pana FZ30 at the moment and I'm willing to wait and assess the situation in the new year.
Then it will either be the D80 or the 30D (if the 30D comes down in price)
Thanks again for your feedback

ollieholmes
06-11-06, 09:07
Ive been to have a play with a D80 in a shop and i realy like it. The first thing i noticed was the weight of it, it is noticably heavier than my D50. The focus is good and fast and does not hunt it seemed during about 20 mins of playing (the shop staff are so helpfull there). Im going to go back this week with one of my lenses and see if i can see a speed difference in it compared to my D50.

robski
06-11-06, 10:43
Lello don't make the classic mistake of getting hung up on the body. You should give equal or more thought to the type of photography you want to do and the range of lens you might use. Your best lenses will see many camera bodies come and go.

Leif
06-11-06, 13:09
I would not be so concerned that the 20D is discontinued. It is still a very good camera, and parts will be available for some time to come. As far as I know in terms of image quality it is up their with the 30D and D80. The D80 will give a bit more resolution, but has a plastic build rather than metal, and no true mirror lock up.

I would make sure that you handle both cameras, and compare the look and feel. Otherwise I agree with Rob. The body is the entry into the system, and you really need to take into account the entire system. Figure out what sort of lens collection you will build up, and see which manufacturer provides what you want, and what the cost will be. Availability of kit in your country will matter.

BTW I use the Nikon system, and have not used Canon AF.

Leif

Canis Vulpes
06-11-06, 13:24
Bodies are coming out all the time if you wait then it may be the case of waiting again for the next hot body. The result is losing time and enthusiasm for photography, tomorrow never comes. Go with your instinct and be happy with no regrets.

I am currently interested in an obsolete camera - makes no difference whether current or not, in fact I prefer an obsolete body as no-one is interested. I had a D2X within weeks of release and had to fight people off with a $hitty stick who wanted to bother me about it. 18-months later no-one interested. Phew - I can get on with my business and concentrate on my photography.

Is now a good time to mention the forthcoming Nikon D40? :rolleyes:

Lello
06-11-06, 21:32
Rob, I know the lens is as important if not more important than the Cam, I just feel that as this is going to be my first D SLR I should buy the newest/best technology as I can afford at the time, And have that as a starting point and build up the lenses I might need as I go along.
Leif, You are probably right in saying that that the 20D is a very good cam but at the price I found (£600) was slightly more than i wanted to spend,
But if the 20D had been a newer model I would have bitten the salesman's hand off,(even at that price) I have now discarded the 400D off my shopping list, As much as the good reviews it's had I don't like the feel. So to conclude,
(for example) Would you buy a Pentium 3 PC as they became discontinued or a Pentium 4 with all the latest technology, (assuming you couldn't afford a dual core PC) i.e Nikon D200.
Stephen, I take it that the forthcoming D40 is an entry level Nikon?
Thanks again for all your feedback

miketoll
06-11-06, 21:41
At the moment the D40 is an unconfirmed leak but if the details are true then its a very basic camera below the D50.

Lello
06-11-06, 21:44
Then thats off my shopping list as well

Christine
06-11-06, 23:02
Lello,do you subscribe to the mag,Amateur Photographer.It is a weekly mag.There are lots of dealers who advertise used bargains,all very reputable.You should be able to pick up a good 20D .This cam is very good,the only con factor I have against it is the loud shutter click.One press of the button,and the birds are off!!.It has always received excellent reviews.But if you do see one advertised if there is a choice between sep body with/without the kit lens,I would opt for the body only,and if you can afford it,buy a decent lens,again these lenses are all offered in the used sections.

Lello
06-11-06, 23:09
Thanks Christine, I will have a look at the mag and see whats is about.

Don Hoey
07-11-06, 22:53
Well its hard but you're the one that should make the final decision and remember as long as you have your money in your pocket, you have the easy buying power. Make the one decision that keeps you happiest and no mater what, waiting and refrain form impulsive decisions works perfectly in your favor.

Hi Lello,

I have missed all this ( busy elsewhere ). Totaly agree with Sassan. As you have no comitment by way of lenses then which ever system you buy into it is down to what appeals. If it is between Canon and Nikon both have good brand glass. Cheaper alternatives available from Sigma or Tamron.

If you are not in a desperate rush then I would suggest the New Years sales as the best time to buy price wise, and have a play in the shops in the mean time.

Slightly contrary to Rob I think the body is important. Although image quality may be marginal between certain brand models you have to enjoy your photography. Consider things like brightness of viewfinder, ease of operation of controls, menu navigation and how they would fit with what you would consider ideal.

I have to admit to still struggling with menus. I still think a la F2 or F3.:D

No mention of Pentax yet or have you discounted it.

Don

Gidders
07-11-06, 22:58
When I was looking to get into the dSLR field, like most it came down to a Nikon/Canon choice. For me what decided it was the lenses that suited my photographic interests...

I went for a 20D + 17-85 IS rather than the standrad lens, and have since acquired a 70-300 IS as well

miketoll
07-11-06, 23:03
Also Sony and Olympus (a bit short on choice of lenses) just to confuse things further! Pentax and Sony have built in anti shake to put in the melting pot along with their versions of sensor cleaning. Read reviews etc and then go have a play with the models that interest you, handling and feel is very important. Have fun choosing then go for it :D

miketoll
07-11-06, 23:07
When I was looking to get into the dSLR field, like most it came down to a Nikon/Canon choice. For me what decided it was the lenses that suited my photographic interests...

I went for a 20D + 17-85 IS rather than the standrad lens, and have since acquired a 70-300 IS as well

Not meaning to pinch the thread but how do you rate the 17-85 IS as I am considering one when funds permit?

Adey Baker
07-11-06, 23:24
I see that Canon are now offering £100 cash-back on the 30D, making it about £650 body only from UK dealers. A good price for a good camera and a sure sign that a replacement is coming (stating the obvious, of course, as replacements are always on the way!)

Lello
07-11-06, 23:47
Hi Don,
Since the last time you said for me to go out and play with the camera's I've been interested in I have been out nearly every weekend looking,touching,playing and I think my mind is made up, I'm going for the D80.
As I said earlier I'm in no hurry but the camera shops in the January sales won't know what's hit them. But If I can find a good deal on the 30D (with cash back) then I might change my mind, But they the only 2 cams I'm going to look for with a view to buy. I've never really considered the Pentax or Olympus. So all I need to do now is start saving. Or I could always start a buy Lello a Camera for Christmas charity!!!

Don Hoey
08-11-06, 00:01
Hi Lello,

Just got your FZ30 up on DPR. I guess you are in a similar boat to Chris in that you currently have a huge zoom range ( 12x out to 420mm ). Lens choice will be the major thing if you regularly use the full range you currently have.

Do you have any thoughts in that direction ?

Don

Lello
08-11-06, 00:19
I'm not going to sell the FZ30 (I love it) if I were going to sell it, Buying a new cam would be much easier with the extra cash in my pocket.
So the idea is buy a half decent lens for my new cam (whatever that might be) maybe 35-70 lens,Then learn how to use the new cam with everybody's help on the forum,Then when I'm happy with my ability I will start looking at bigger lenses. Not forgetting I will still have the FZ30 with an Olympus T-CON17 tele converter to get closer to the action. And you do realize I will be asking lot's of questions about taking photo's with the the new D-SLR?
And when I need help with lenses I'm sure you guys will steer me in the right direction.

jvhigbee
08-11-06, 04:49
The D80 is great. The available lenses would not work for me. I use Canon and the glass is the reason. Not that Nikon doesn't make extremely good lenses, but I find the variety and consistancy and availability of Canon lenses suit me better.

Gidders
08-11-06, 21:16
Not meaning to pinch the thread but how do you rate the 17-85 IS as I am considering one when funds permit?

Mike - Ill post a separate thread in the Equipment Reviews forum in the next few days - going dancing tonight :D & got a portrait session booked tomorrow so it will be sometime over the weekend

Birdsnapper
06-12-06, 22:09
I've read negative reviews about the 350D and 400D small size - especially what to do with your little finger. For the last 25 years, I've always curled my little finger under the camera for extra support, and I still do it with my 20D. You get a more secure support without a white knuckle grip.

I use my wife's 350D with Tamron 200-400 zoom on a tripod. Having all shooting info on the LCD means that the camera does not have to be tilted to check settings - useful if you need to keep the camera trained on one spot, but need to check/change ISO etc.

When I bought the 20D, there was no real competition, but now DSLRs are all so good and alike I would pick the camera to suit my budget.

I've only posted this to try to confuse you sall the more!!!!!!!!!

Birdsnapper

jammie*dodger
07-12-06, 22:24
As my 30D is currently up for sale on another forum for £580 boxed as new I think this is a pretty bad deal TBH. If your interested let me know ;-)

Hope that's not against the rules :-0

Lello
08-12-06, 00:04
Could let me know how old it is (any warranty left?) and is body only?
I'm in Hertfordshire so picking up is no prob, Although I wasn't going to buy till new year, and I was going for a D80, I might reconsider my situation.
Thanks
Lello

jammie*dodger
08-12-06, 08:33
It's body only and it's just out ouf warranty i'm afraid. I can move a bit on the price if I don't have to pay ebay and paypal fees ;-) Can also meet 1/2 way if that helps (Stevenage maybe?)

Lello
08-12-06, 11:15
Hi Jammie
I would really have to think hard about spending £500+ without a warranty.
At this moment in time I can get a brand newD80 for £540 http://www.cameraworld.co.uk/ViewProdDetails.asp?prod_code=PON06H000016&Prod_name=Nikon%20D80%20Body%20with%20FREE%202GB%2 0Pro%20SD%20card (http://www.cameraworld.co.uk/ViewProdDetails.asp?prod_code=PON06H000016&Prod_name=Nikon%20D80%20Body%20with%20FREE%202GB%2 0Pro%20SD%20card) And just wandering how much they will be in the January sales!!! + A new 30D comes with £100 cash back at the moment,http://www.mycameras2006.com/myshop/canon-body-p-32.html (with cash back ) So as I said it will have to a very good price.

jammie*dodger
08-12-06, 12:39
Fair enough. Rob.

Bevb
16-02-07, 23:41
I have just upgraded from the 20D to the 1D MKllN purely for my wildlife bird flight photography ( and im greedy!) although i wouldnt dream of getting rid of my 20D, its a great camera, 5fps if your doing wildlife/sport, and the camera is made so fingers can find the buttons comfortably, ok so the LCD screen is small, but its what you get used to, but for image quality i cant fault it.


I agree with Christines comments re the good quality lense, worth it in the long run.