Christine,

Tomorrow I will reverse a 50 onto another 50 and 105 to see the level of magnification and if there is vignetting how much. So hold on until then.

As I discovered this evening for an experiment of Daves set up, 50 reversed on a 200 gives huge magnifiction. 5 1/2 mm is all you will see in the long side of the viewfinder.

The pogram works well but I have only done staight stacks. I will post screen grabs of the route I took.

The prog is quite complicated so I just took the easy way out once I had found it. :D :rolleyes:

Don

Anyone with a set of bellows may be able to adapt them as a focussing rail.

I have a set of Olympus OM bellows which haven't seen much use in recent years but by adding the 'Focus Stage' and removing the actual bellows bit you have a first class unit to fit many cameras.

Finding a focus stage for sale is the hard bit - I eventually homed-in on one (new!) at B&H in New York at a very reasonable price. B&H seem to have a bit of a 'mixed' rating from customers but I ordered my unit on a Thursday morning and it arrived the following Tuesday morning. This was a few weeks ago when the exchange rate was about $2 to the £ and the total cost including quite a lump for postage was £44

The images were taken in RAW and converted to Tiff 8bit as I don't think the program can handle 16 bit. I guess they could just have easily been Best Quality JPEGs. The important thing is that they are in the same folder. I numbered them 1, 2, 3, 4 etc as I converted them so they would load sequentially.

Open CZM and select File - New then navigate to the folder containing the images. Hold down Control key and select all the images you wish to stack. Once selected go to Macro and select - Do Stack. Then sit back while the program does the stack. Once stacked save for Photoshoping.

Don

Thanks for that Don, I can't wait to give it a try tomorrow, I will try first with the bellows for the macro.

Christine,

Here are a set of full frame pics to show the magnification effect of reversing a 50mm lens on another lens. 50 on a 50 shows serious vignetting. A steel ruler marked in milimeters was used so you can see how large or should I say small the field of view is.

Pic 1 : 200mm f4 with reverse 50mm f1.4
Pic 2 : 105mm f2.5 with reversed 50mm f1.4
Pic 3 : 50mm f1.4 with rversed 50mm f2
Pic 4 : The lunatic fringe and just for fun, 200mm f4 with reversed 24mm f2.8. Focussing this is a nighmare.

Don

Thanks Don, that been a big help, saves me some money and we could do without extra expense at the moment. The magnification looks great with the 200mm and reversed 50mm, I will set my 75-300 to 200 and see what I can get.

Thanks for the links Adey and Don. I've put the 454 micro positioning plate on my "must get when the cash is available" list.

Dave

I'm reliably informed that 'Mr Cad' in Croydon www.mrcad.co.uk have a s/h focus stage in stock for anyone with a set of OM bellows that they want to use as a focus-rail. No idea of the price, though.

I ordered one from these people:

http://www.digitaldepot.co.uk/acatal...cessories.html


They are a bit cheaper. I also ordered a Kirk quick release platform, and I'll get a Chinese AS plate.

Thanks Leif. I have just taken delivery of a 454 from WE, but no doubt others will be interested.

Dave

I hope you will let us know how you get on with it Dave. A positive review may well get me on the trail for one.

Don

To be honest I should have gone through WE as that is where I am buying the QR platform, and they do next day delivery as standard. DD take 3 to 5 days. Sigh.

So, who's first for a review then? I will wait a little while before posting impressions.

Sorry not to have given my impressions before but have been rather busy of late. Today I had my first go with the 154 and it does just what I hoped it would. I have it mounted on a Manfrotto 405 head (which I bought to take to Australia to carry the driven mount for astrophotography) and so have fine control of the angle of the camera and now with the 154 backwards and forwards movement as well. There is slight backlash but it did not cause me a problem. To test it I have used a 200mm lens with 1.4TC and a reversed old 50mm lens on the front which I believe will give a real magnification of 5.6x
My subject is ordinary table salt. At the same time I thought I would have a go of the CZM program to improve the depth of field and as the adjustments would have to be very fine, make a good test of the 154. The camera was set at an angle of approx 45 degrees and I took six pictures with the point of focus at different depths in the field of view.

I am certainly pleased with the 154, the control was perfectly adequate in this situation. It has a large range of movement (120mm) and conveniently two places to adjust the movement in case one for example ends up in an awkward place. There is also a locking screw as well as a lever that releases the whole plate so that very rough positioning can be quickly obtained. The instructions warn you to be carefull using that with a camera mounted as the camera, if not supported, could suddenly move under its own weight and get damaged.

As far as the CZM is concerned six pictures wasn't enough in this case and there are a few obvious errors in the stacking especially on the right and double images near the bottom. Even from this quick trial a reasonable image can be obtained by cropping those bits out.

The first picture is one of the frames and the second is the 6 stacked.

I hope this helps.

Dave

Following a suggestion from Don, here are some closer pics of the 454 micropositioning plate which may be of interest to any potential purchaser.

Dave

Nice one Dave,

Thanks for that. At least you can see what you are getting in a lot more detail than from the Manfrotto catalogue or web site.

Don

I had a play with the Manfrotto focussing stage, and a reversed 28mm lens on my D200. The subject was a docile Marbled White Butterfly. The image is rather poor, but at least it gives an idea of what can be done. The only way is up! :)

I've attached the image and a 100% crop. There is some fuzziness near the eye, and I am not convinced that is not an artifact of the lens. I used a Nikon 28mm F2.8 AIS lens at F16.

What I found out is that:

a) DOF is incredibly shallow making focussing very tough even with a rail.
b) The slightest bit of wind makes life impossible.
c) Composition is incredibly hard (see point a).
d) Lighting is hard because the lens is so close to the subject.
e) The lens sharpness at F16 seems pretty good, at least within the small zone of sharp focus. Chromatic aberration is zero.
f) I focussed with the lens wide open. I then had to stop the lens down. This is a right pain because you have to put your finger near the subject, potentially knocking it, and it is hard to see the aperture scale too.

What is really needed is a miniature focussing stage with movements of no more than an inch maximum. Ideally x, y and rotational movements are needed. Something like the bit on a lathe that holds the tool turret would be ideal, but smaller and lighter.

Or use flash and dispense with the tripod ...

The more I try this the more I admire the fantastic 2:1 close ups on some web sites.

Hi Leif :).... Welcome to the pain and joy of reversing.... I find hand holding makes life a lot easier when you can't control every aspect of the shot... As you see the slightest movement makes the difference between a sharp shot and sh_t shot..... With to much gear it is impossible to adjust on the fly... I find that once I achieve focus, I them rock back and forth very slightly to fine tune the eye.... Here is an example I may have posted already, but I can give you many....This is 4:1 This is your thread so I am not going to high jack it.... With lots of practice hand holding produces pretty consistent results..... Oh yes with a reversed lens an out front diffused flash is a must.. BTW I really like what you produced.....Take care.....

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n.../IMG_29213.jpg

Hello Alex. That is a great shot of a monster creature. Or was it small? :) What equipment did you use? Sorry if you have mentioned this elsewhere, but it can sometimes be hard to locate earlier posts.

On a more general topic, here is a very nice web site with some lovely information about reversed lenses. His images IMO are outstanding, and what's more, he uses relatively simple equipment (probably the same as Alex?):

http://blog.mdsign.nl/

I like his simple diffuser for use with a reversed lens. It looks easily carried about in a camera ruck sack too.

This thread seems to have calmed down. But in case anyone is interested.

I tried the Dutch man's technique of a reversed 28mm lens on a D200 with the built in flash for lighting. For various reasons I could not get on with it. It is well worth trying, but maybe my hands are too shaky.

I also tried my Nikon 60mm F2.8 AF lens with tubes to go to nearly twice life size. This was much more successful. See the attachment for a Ringlet Butterfly seen close up. I think the picture is in many respects a success, but I found 2 key points:

1) The lens was so close to the insect that it was almost touching it, and disturbing the nearly vegetation, including the leaf the insect was resting on.

2) Because the lens was so close to the insect, the lens was shading it from daylight, and the built in flash. Hence the lighting is very flat and reduces the impact of the image.

In other words, the image is sharp, but the lighting is poor, and hence the image is a bit dull IMO.

One little success I had was a home made diffuser. I've read the excellent descriptions of home made diffuseres on this site, but I was always concerned that they were not easy to carry in a rucksack, as they look crushable. I had some old Waitrose pudding containers that I use for collecting fungi samples and they looked ideal. They are about 4" across and 2" deep with a pop on top. I filled one with thin crumpled foam sheet (about 1mm thick) and attached it to the front of the built in flash with an elastic band. It turned out to be very effective and it can be carried in a rucksack without risk of damage. And if it falls off the camera onto concrete it will not break or split. If there is a request, I can post a photo of the diffuser. (It is very basic.)

The second attachment is a Burnet moth photographed with a 200mm lens and the built in flash set to provide fill flash, and the diffuser attached. It has helped avoid harsh specular highlights which can be a problem on the moth's wings.

BTW the butterfly photo was taken at F22, and the camera was mounted on the Manfrotto focussing rail. I can report that the rail works very well indeed. Thus far I am a happy customer.

Yes please Leif, can you post a picture of your defuser.

I like your results above - great stuff.

I'm still very interested in this thread, just don't have much time to get out.

Dave

Here's a picture of the diffuser attached to an old manual camera. I think you can see that it is no more than a plastic desert tub attached with an elastic band to the built in flash. The fact that it is angled upwards slightly does not seem to matter too much.

Thanks Leif, that looks good and simple and as you say strong enough for carrying around. I'll give it a try.

Dave

Wisher makes little diffusers, they work great on the pop ups.

Jacky?

Dave

A bit of catching up on the thread.
 

Leif,
I see in post #97 you discovered the trials of a reversed 28mm. When I clear out the workshop I will look at a solution to controlling the aperture lever from the side.
I have to admit my last session was a reversed 50 f1.4 on the 105mm to get round the problem. Magnification is not as great though.

Post #100 Superb pictures with your home made flash diffuser and the pop up. :cool: I will try your plastic desert tub idea on the SB80-DX.

Christine,
Jacky's diffusers look great for a pop up in loads of applications.

Dave and Leif,
I got the Manfrotto focussing rail today but have yet to give it a go. Cannot get to a lot of my kit as its in a workshop drawer behind the junk.:(

Don

Following on from Leifs home made diffuser for the pop up flash. Today I cut the top off a 1 litre milk bottle and attatched the bottom part to the SB80-DX flash to see what the result would be like. The flash had a Stofen diffuser attatched to spread the output inside the poly milk container.

Attatched pic is a full flash shot. 55mm micro and 28mm tube.

I will play more towards the end of the week when my diy project is finally complete. I'll get in trouble with the boss if there are too many photographic diversions. ;) :)

Don

Excellent depth of field Don. I wish I could get such a shot when I'm trying let alone just experimenting!

By the way, welcome back. I thought you may have gone on a long holiday.

Dave

Perhaps we should have a Macro play when I am fully back in action as I see Christine also has a new toy.

Holiday .............. NO. :(

Mega Jobs .......... YES :( Nearly done ......... YES :)

Don

From reading a few posts from while I have been away, it seems there is some interest in 'on the cheap' macro, or at least closeup.

A bit of a thread bump so I can easily find it and look at anything we did not cover that may be of interest to anyone wanting to give it a bash. Closeup filters comes to mind, so I've just had another rummage in the loft and will look at doing some comparison shots between using closeup filters and tubes.

Don

Any ideas for DIY diffusers for macro ring flashes?

I can only think of taping diffusing sheet materials but that might be cumbersome if the tape leaves residue behind.

Not knowing your kit, it may be worth you checking this thread to see if it is of interest.
http://www.worldphotographyforum.com...ght=ring+flash

Don

Close up lenses
 

One low cost option is close up lenses. Quality of these is a big factor to consider. The ones used here, apart from the 4x, are Hoya from the 1980's so I do not know how they compare with todays offerings. You really get what you pay for with these, and higher quality offerings from 3x often have two elements. To ensure that the 100% views would be a realistic reflection of these particular lenses I use my 55 micro which is sharp across the frame.

The first thing when considering close up lenses is trying to guage the field of view, or subject magnification, for a given dioptre. Tricky if you are just looking at a catalogue or web page. To show that I have done a quick job from 1x to 5x on a crop sensor. To arrive at scale I chose 55mm as the most likely long end of a kit zoom. Focus was near 2ft to represent what may be near the minimum focus of such a lens. Lens focus remained unchanged throughout the set.

The closeups I used here are 52mm, the lens filter size. However if you look at Ros's gallery for anything stating 'diy closeup lens', then for none critical at the edge of frame subjects they are an affordable solution. Ros has a number of her shots printed to A4 hanging on her wall and they look great. In the case of the close up lenses that Ros has, these are of bigger diameter than the lens thread and that may have a positive impact. Ros's gallery here
http://www.worldphotographyforum.com...user=2754&sl=r

Pics attached
Two sets going from 1x to 5x
A composite with 100% unsharpened views from the 2x, 3x, and a stack of the 2x and 3x giving 5x.

Don

Thanks Don. I have had my brain in gear since then and have an idea that involves high density foam and some plastic glazing sheets. Will post if it works out okay.

This may be of interest. I see Cambridge in Colour has added some articles on macro.

Intro link http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tec...aphy-intro.htm


Macro lenses with calculators for Magnification, Magnification and sensor size, Macro dof calculator, Diffraction limit calculator.
http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tut...cro-lenses.htm

Extension tubes and close up lenses
http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tut...es-closeup.htm

Don

lens stacking etc.
 

What a fascinating thread - I think it's worth another Bump :)

I've played with macro quite a bit over the years and collected loads of different options, (though my shots are not up to the standard of most of those in the thread)

Recently I've mainly been lazy just using either a 100mm Cosina macro, or a stacked 50mm f/1.7 on either the macro of kit lens Lighting being either with the pop up flash diffused by tissue ( or Cigarette papers) or with a TTL flash bounced of a sheet of card. The bounce flash was used in both the macro images I've put in the gallery so far.

The only real experiments I've done recently have been using telescope eyepieces stacked with the kit lens I plan to try them on their own soon - as I've got a helicoid focuser for them rigged up. The stacked eyepieces have had some success (the Knot macro I've posted was using a 40mm eyepiece) The 10mm eyepiece was less successful the image was so dark the only thing I could manage to focus was a lightshade & the eyepiece was bumping into the shade...

I did see the pic in your gallery and am still pondering that one. Maybe I'll give it a go as I have a spotting scope eyepiece. :)

Currently looking for a new project to work on. :rolleyes: :D

Don

eyepiece mounting
 

Well I'm afraid my 'workshops' is much less sophisticated than yours from the little I've seen. So I cheated horribly - I got a T2 helicoid focuser from scopes n skies (in their 'astroboot') for £12, screwed on an T2 holder for 1¼" eyepieces and a T2 to 52mm adapter (possibly with a T" male/male connector?) the intention has always been to mount it directly on the camera, but I've got a massive list of projects to work on & not enough time (all spent on the web???)

I must start using my tripod/macro rail so I can be a bit more scientific about my trials....

Ha,ha.
When you have been through some more of the on 'the cheap threads', ... yep even more time on the web :rolleyes: ( so even less work time ), you may have even more projects that are not on your current list. :D :D

Don