I don't want to be a bore with this but I feel there are fundamental rights being undermined.
Below is both my request for information (bottom of the page) and the NT's reply. (under the next couple of paragraphs)
In any other situation I have no problem with landowners exercising rights and negotiating with photographers who have commercial intent. Neither do I have a problem with some NT pay sites, and especially interiors, where the use of the site would be disrupted or activity even harmful to art works etc.
What does bother me is whether the NT would try and enforce the bye-law on all sites. So would we need permission and possibly charges and rights restrictions on images made on the right to roam areas of NT property. They indicate they are not currently enforcing policy in these areas. But that doesn't mean they won't.
There are other issues with competitions too where all rights are seized on entry, this is seperate but still unacceptable in my view without negotiation or payment.
Here is the NT's reply
Dear Ned,
Many thanks for your email enquiring about what is and is not permitted with regard to the private and/or commercial use of works produced on National Trust land.
The National Trust is protected from unsanctioned commercial exploitation by a byelaw passed in 1965, which states:
'No unauthorised person shall on Trust Property sell or offer or expose for sale any commodity or article or for the purpose of trade or reward take any photograph'.
This section of the 1965 National Trust byelaws is the basis on which the Trust's photographic policy is based. Our policy is explicit in welcoming people to take photographs out of doors at properties for personal use and research but the Trust does not permit photography for profit or publication without permission. For commercial photography of gardens, architectural exteriors and interiors, permission is required. Please contact the Media and Broadcast Liaison Officer, Harvey Edgington on: 020 7447 6759. If permission is given, the photographers are asked to confirm contractually that the pictures are for one-time use only. We may invite them to consider lodging appropriate images in the National Trust Photo Library on an agency basis. Photography for other photo libraries is never permitted.
This policy has been in place for some years and is accepted by professionals in the photographic world. It was worked out in association with the Historic Houses Association and English Heritage. It echoes the sentiments of the founders of the National Trust who, even then, were concerned that the National Trust should not be exploited commercially.
The National Trust is a charity with the statutory purpose of conserving places of historic interest or natural beauty for the benefit of the nation. It, therefore, has a duty to protect and husband its resources so as to be better able to carry out its conservation work. This conservation remit means that it is vital to have the ability to manage the marketing of Trust property. The Trust must also be careful not to advertise inadvertently or endorse products with which it does not wish to be associated. In addition many of its properties are leased to tenants and their concerns have to be taken into account and respected accordingly.
The byelaw protecting the Trust relates to all National Trust property, including non-paying properties such as coastlines and landscapes. However, the editorial use of images taken on non-paying properties is not something that we are currently enforcing given that the issue of marketing property is not so sensitive. Therefore images you create on, for instance, Snowdon would not be monitored for improper use, whereas images taken at Fountains Abbey would be in breach of our policy.
You also refer to public rights of way. You are perfectly entitled to sell photographs taken on designated public footpaths or highways for editorial use, or any use where a property release is not required by the end user. This only applies to legally defined public footpaths and not to all footpaths. Where boundaries are unclear it is, I'm afraid, the photographer's responsibility to check whether or not s/he is on NT land. This would be true of any privately owned land, including land freely open to the public (such as the Royal Parks in London).
Any form of commercial activity conducted on paid entry National Trust properties must be sanctioned by the relevant department. This would include anyone setting up an easel to paint etc. Access to such activities is commonly granted but permission must be sought, as must evidence of the relevant public liability insurance (currently £6m).
I hope this is helpful to you.
Regards,
Chris.
Chris Rowlin
Rights Manager
t The National Trust Photo Library
www.ntpl.org.uk
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Here is my original request for information
Sent: 05 May 2009 18:34
To: Berry, Grant; Photo Library
Subject: Photography Rights, permissions
Dear enquiries,
I am seeking information with regard to photographic activities on Trust land for amateur and commercial use. As a keen photographer I want to make sure I am within the law.
Can you tell me what is allowed and what isn't. Permissions, licenses', exclusions etc.
If there are restrictions on the commercial use of images taken on Trust land can you explain what the restrictions are.
Also if a license can be purchased can you inform me of the cost and permissions it grants. Is there for instance a license that allows photography on mountain trails,fells etc. that covers activity annually or has each separate visit has to be negotiated, or attract a set fee. Further to this does each landscape view have a value?
I know to go fishing anywhere you need a "government" rod license. Does the Trust operate their own similar scheme for photography?
My primary query is related to landscape photography in the Lake District National Park. You may be aware there is some debate within photographic groups and communities about recent events where web based image libraries,vendors, etc. have been asked to remove images taken from Trust property and land. Rights issues I believe are at the heart such requests.
For instance what is the thinking on an amateur photographer posting an image of a mountain tarn, on say facebook or flickr where the intention is for relatives, friends etc. to view it. Do I assume there is commercial use on the part of facebook and flickr. The intention of the photographer is personal use? I suppose the term applied by the NT ......."any form of reproduction"..... covers such an instance.
I can understand the charges for the booking of Country Houses and estates etc. for Commercial filming and photographic shoots that restrict other user access or are overly intrusive. However if I pay to visit Fountains Abbey what are the restrictions on any images I make of the Abbey ruins or grounds. Surely I made a contribution to the upkeep of the site through the entry fee? So if I have to pay for commercial use of those images, what is the basis. It won't interfere with the NT's primary functions, or accessibility for others, the footfall won't accelerate erosion etc. So what part of the Trusts Act does it compromise?
I am a tad confused with more expansive areas that are covered by "the right to roam" and public rights of way where individuals and their photographic activity may be non intrusive. Whether they are for commercial reasons or personal use. Areas where there is no expectation of charges. Areas where land ownership and boundaries may not be clear on the day. If I make an image of Haystacks from the public highway and want commercial gain, I assume its the National Parks Parks Authority who could require permissions, fact is local government does not levy such charges, but what if I'm on the footpath to the summit?
Also can you inform me if the same types of any restriction and licensing apply to artists, painters etc. who may well "capture" the same landscape a photographer captures, and for commercial gain. If not can you advise the reasoning for any discrimination.
I can't find any easy reference to these issues on you web site.
Thanks for your anticipated help.
Ned Ward